HQ: Heroes & Villains (knightkrawler) - DISCUSSION

[Big Bene]

OK, my own approach would be somewhat different anyway:

I would make looting a dead monster or hero a special action. In both cases, the looting hero would have to stand on the same square as the corpse, and "loot", instead of attacking, searching, or spell-using. In the case of dead monsters, he would draw a card from a special "loot monsters" deck, in the case of a hero, he would get this heroe's equipment (including gold). Looting of course is only possible when no surviving enemies are in the same room, just like searching. If all heroes leave the room, the corpses disappear (carried away or eaten by wandering monsters).

The hero that has taken the equipment is free to give it to the new character of the dead heroe's player, or to keep as much as he wants. That's not as egoistic as it sounds. After all, we're talking about the belongings of his companion of many adventures which he is to share with a total stranger that has just joined the party recently.

This would provide reason for the players to have their heroes survive.
If you are lucky, you get all of the equipment, but theres a fair chance that you get nothing.

[whitebeard]

I would leave monster looting the way KK has it. For the monster, it is part of the killing stroke action. The monsters don't have any actions anyway.

We also seem to be confusing the loss of gold "to the party" with loss of gold "to the player". When the hero dies why would the next hero get his gold? KK's rules say the other players get the equipment. If the gold stayed, then they would recieve this as well. Why would the Heros give some new guy their gold? Equipment maybe.

[Big Bene]

Why would the Heros give some new guy their gold? Equipment maybe.

What I said.

[mitchiemasha]

Nice... A looting dead monsters and heroes deck...

With things like the characters weapon is broken and of no use but you find 20GC. It could also have different results for Hero and monsters on 1 card. Then the monster cards would need to reference what weapon that monster has. A looting hero could find, daggers, potions, jems, keys (as described in the Quest notes for the expansion the looting deck comes with), Maps that make the EWP reveal all pittraps etc and even curses. Some of the more powerful finds may even need a roll to effect or deflect.

[cynthialee]

A new hero would likely get any class specific gear my hero was carrying that my hero could not use. But if my dead homey had a magic item I could use, the new guy can suck it. I don't care his 'last hero had it'. Now my hero has it.

[knightkrawler]

Well, I've made my decision to keep the rule. I think it's the only way to keep the advantage I mentioned, which I do want.
Now, how explain in-rules to go with BB's suggestion? Difficult to implement this and there's no precedent elsewhere in the rulebook.
In the 1st EU edition of HQ, was the rule that you couldn't move into the same square twice during the same round (to keep heroes from opening doors and then retreating, probably) explained anyhow? Because that is my precedent for a rule that is pure mechanics without any "logic" or "realism" presented.

[sajungzak]

I was just saying that's how I would explain it. Like the agreement Thorin and company had Bilbo sign before he joined.

In the same manner that gold has been micromanaged by precedence, it could be included in every quest's Parchment Text.

[Lemmeron]

If your hero kicks the bucket and the other heroes are not in the same room, the monster can either a) loot all the gold and be removed from the game, escaping with the gold
b) loot all the gold and any usable weapons and armour, now becomming stronger and attempt to kill the other heroes (more aimed at elite or boss characters) OR attempt to escape to the stairs taking the gold and artifacts with them...

If other heroes are in the room when a hero is reduced to 0 body/mind points, the monster is able to pick up the gold, but must then move to escape and remain out of sight of heroes until the evil wizard's next turn begins, at which point it escapes with all the gold and is removed from the board. OR an elite monster could scoop up any usable weapon / shield (not armour) from the downed hero and attempt to kill remaining heroes with their new found weapons.

you could even have multiple adjacent monsters picking up different stuff and running in all directions trying to ecape - making heroes have to decide if they use their actions to heal the downed hero, chase the monster with the artifact they want, or hunt the damn goblin that is running away with the gold !

I would say a monster who gets out of sight for a full turn with gold can be removed from the board with the gold lost. But any artifact carrying monsters must make it to the stairs or exit before the artifact is lost to players

[whitebeard]

If your hero kicks the bucket and the other heroes are not in the same room, the monster can either a) loot all the gold and be removed from the game, escaping with the gold
b) loot all the gold and any usable weapons and armour, now becomming stronger and attempt to kill the other heroes (more aimed at elite or boss characters) OR attempt to escape to the stairs taking the gold and artifacts with them...

If other heroes are in the room when a hero is reduced to 0 body/mind points, the monster is able to pick up the gold, but must then move to escape and remain out of sight of heroes until the evil wizard's next turn begins, at which point it escapes with all the gold and is removed from the board. OR an elite monster could scoop up any usable weapon / shield (not armour) from the downed hero and attempt to kill remaining heroes with their new found weapons.

you could even have multiple adjacent monsters picking up different stuff and running in all directions trying to ecape - making heroes have to decide if they use their actions to heal the downed hero, chase the monster with the artifact they want, or hunt the damn goblin that is running away with the gold !

I would say a monster who gets out of sight for a full turn with gold can be removed from the board with the gold lost. But any artifact carrying monsters must make it to the stairs or exit before the artifact is lost to players

Why does it have to be so difficult for the player to lose everything? This is the best part about death. Sure the other heroes can equip a new hero with the best equipment, but the artifacts cannot be purchased. Periodic death, rust spells, theft, etc. keeps the power of your heroes in check. This is necessary, so that a band of Orcs is always a challenge. If there are no other heroes in the room, the slaying monster immediately drops the treasure in some black hole (like the pit trap you cannot find when you search for traps, but fall into when you search for treasure). The monster fully intends to retrieve the gold later after slaying the rest of the heroes. Good luck ever finding it!!! It is gone. Furthermore, if a powerful artifact is to be lost, it can be that Zargon/Morcar has become aware of it and transports it to another dungeon to protect it. Hence the heroes may find it again later (as the rules suggest for missing necessary artifacts).

The first thing the monsters do is lift your purse (even with the other heroes in the room). It's right there on your belt and the monsters cannot resist! Perhaps the mindless undead (zombies and skeletons) do not take the money unless controlled by someone who would. But any other undead creature or leader is likely to hoard wealth as it would have in life.

In a horde of monsters, the purse is gone. A lone monster against a group of heroes is tough to justify. But as a mechanic it works and in this case, the purse could have been tossed into a deep dark hole. The player needs to get over it.

[cynthialee]

get over it,,,wonderful strategy to keep the players interested and wanting to play your games
NOT