Line of Sight from within a Pit

[Bareheaded Warrior]

The edge of a pit trap serves as such a horizontal dividing-line for line of sight. I'd say the depth of a pit trap is no more than 6 1/2 feet deep, or a bit over 2 meters. Were it any deeper, the Dwarf would be unable to climb out unaided-yet the rules permit this.

Whilst the statement above may be correct, assuming that because the pit is "no more than 6 1/2 feet deep" means that the pit is 6 1/2 feet deep is not valid. A 1" deep pit is "no more than 6 1/2 feet deep".

[Kurgan]

To see, you simply climb your way out of the pit and stand on the edges in order to see all around you exactly as well as if you were standing upon a normal square. The only time you need to hunker down in there is if you're searching it as a room unto itself (or maybe sharing it with some other characters who fell in).

The attack/defense penalty makes sense, whether you think you're "down in the pit" or unsteady on the edge. Maybe an enemy approaching adjacent forces you to retreat to the edge/down in the pit?

[Daedalus]

The edge of a pit trap serves as such a horizontal dividing-line for line of sight. I'd say the depth of a pit trap is no more than 6 1/2 feet deep, or a bit over 2 meters. Were it any deeper, the Dwarf would be unable to climb out unaided-yet the rules permit this.

Whilst the statement above may be correct, assuming that because the pit is "no more than 6 1/2 feet deep" means that the pit is 6 1/2 feet deep is not valid. A 1" deep pit is "no more than 6 1/2 feet deep".

I judge by the NA rules set. A pit must be large and deep enough to allow for the possibility of it containing a secret door. I feel the shortest height for a secret door comes in at about 3 feet tall, something that can be crawled through without penalty. That would set the minimum depth at 3 feet, though 4 feet would be more reasonable to allow for between-levels constuction material. I think a pit should also be deep enough to cause harm from a surprise fall. Something at least 5 feet deep is in order to be convincing, in my opinion. (Your spiked pit is a nice alternative, but I want to stay true to the tile art.)

That easy-to-remember 5' depth of a 4'x4' pit is preferable to me now as it provides a better scaling of line of sight--something important to me though not necessarily others. Working things out vertically using the gameboard squares and judging vertical LoS from the attacker's shoulder to half the height (head to toe) of the target, I discovered three ranges when attacking from within the pit: Goblin height--1square, human height--2 squares, Gargoyle height--3 squares. From outside a pit attacking in, the ranges are reduced by 1 down to a minimum of 1 (adjacent)--this is an actual result of the cover afforded by the pit. Dwarf-height figures reduce these ranges by 1 down to a minimum of 1 (adjacent).

Though not specified in the pit rules, I wouldn't apply the pit attacking or defending penalties to LoS-dependent attacks or spells like Genie. Ranged attacks don't appear to have been considered, so it's better to judge with the LoS restriction only, in my opinion.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

Fair enough I hadn't considered this under the NA remake rules around being able to be search a pit, even thought you may have already searched the square containing the pit, partly because I don't use that ruleset and partly because some of the rule changes in that edition especially around searching pits, always struck me as a bit odd, and introduced quite a few unintended consequences, such as under that ruleset for this topic, if you are in a pit and search for treasure resulting in you drawing the pit hazard card, how would you handle line of sight if you are in a pit within a pit

EDIT: Thinking about it, the secret door in a pit approach under the remake rules does finally explain the "villain with a limp trope", if every time he wants to enter his secret lair he has to accidentally fall into a pit!

[Onan]

how would you handle line of sight if you are in a pit within a pit

Of course you can search again in the pit within the pit, and since the pit card has been shuffled back, you can find a pit within the pit within the pit

While this would be epic, the US pit hazard is in fact not a "pit", but only a "shallow hole". So I guess you would not be able to search it.

And since it is only a "shallow hole", I guess it doesn't add more confusion to the line of sight handling.

[Parzival]

On a side note, the 2021 and First Light rules state that a Hero in a pit can search it for Treasure and Secret Doors as if it were a chamber, so long as monsters are not present. Is there an official quest book which actually places a Secret Door inside of a pit? (a simple “Yes” will suffice… I’m still working my way through the expansions, so don’t want a heads up to which it might be)

Also, do you allow a Hero to deliberately enter an exposed pit for the purpose of searching it, without taking a wound?

And if a pit contains a Secret Door (or assigned treasure), what happens if the pit is disarmed?

[Kurgan]

On a side note, the 2021 and First Light rules state that a Hero in a pit can search it for Treasure and Secret Doors as if it were a chamber, so long as monsters are not present. Is there an official quest book which actually places a Secret Door inside of a pit? (a simple “Yes” will suffice… I’m still working my way through the expansions, so don’t want a heads up to which it might be)

Also, do you allow a Hero to deliberately enter an exposed pit for the purpose of searching it, without taking a wound?

And if a pit contains a Secret Door (or assigned treasure), what happens if the pit is disarmed?

Yes. ATOH remake suggests a secret door could be found in a pit to resolve the situation of a hero becoming "stuck," but the precise solution is left up to Zargon. If it's disarmed before triggered, Zargon could resort to some other option (such as letting an animal companion take over for the stuck character).

[Daedalus]

On a side note, the 2021 and First Light rules state that a Hero in a pit can search it for Treasure and Secret Doors as if it were a chamber, so long as monsters are not present. Is there an official quest book which actually places a Secret Door inside of a pit? (a simple “Yes” will suffice… I’m still working my way through the expansions, so don’t want a heads up to which it might be)

Also, do you allow a Hero to deliberately enter an exposed pit for the purpose of searching it, without taking a wound?

And if a pit contains a Secret Door (or assigned treasure), what happens if the pit is disarmed?

No.

Yes, but the Hero must still roll a combat die to check for damage, as if jumping in. If this isn't done, discovered pit traps would effectively be disarmed by searching them, which contradicts the separation of actions.

If a pit trap is disarmed, it is gone and the secret door isn't found. If this limitation is to be circumvented, a Quest note would be needed that either explains disarming the trap reveals a secret door or that a secret door may later be found at that square space.

[Parzival]

On a side note, the 2021 and First Light rules state that a Hero in a pit can search it for Treasure and Secret Doors as if it were a chamber, so long as monsters are not present. Is there an official quest book which actually places a Secret Door inside of a pit? (a simple “Yes” will suffice… I’m still working my way through the expansions, so don’t want a heads up to which it might be)

Also, do you allow a Hero to deliberately enter an exposed pit for the purpose of searching it, without taking a wound?

And if a pit contains a Secret Door (or assigned treasure), what happens if the pit is disarmed?

No.

Yes, but the Hero must still roll a combat die to check for damage, as if jumping in. If this isn't done, discovered pit traps would effectively be disarmed by searching them, which contradicts the separation of actions.

If a pit trap is disarmed, it is gone and the secret door isn't found. If this limitation is to be circumvented, a Quest note would be needed that either explains disarming the trap reveals a secret door or that a secret door may later be found at that square space.

I honestly would expect such a quest to indeed note that.

But it really seems odd to me that the rules bother to state that a pit becomes a searchable space for secret doors if no quest then or now ever made use of that concept! I’ve been playing the quests through the Companion App, hoping to find just such a secret door (which I assume would lead to an empty, sub level passage to another chamber, which works more or less like a portal— go through the secret door, you wind up “popping up” in the middle of the other chamber— maybe at a pit within it.
It’s a cool idea, and a nifty contretemps to drop on the players— they haven’t found the objective, despite diligently searching all rooms for secret doors… and all because they failed to search the pit the Dwarf fell in at chamber 3. It’s the sort of devious trick you’d expect from Zargon!