How do you handle Fear vs Courage

[j_dean80]

Barbarian has 3 attack
Wizard casts Courage on him to give "2 extra" attack dice.
Now total of 5

Chaos Warlock comes with Fear at the Barbarian, reducing to 1.
Now total of 3.

Simply wrong. It reduces to "1". Not by "minus 2" or "2 less". "1".

You forgot to quote the most important part of my statement.

[knightkrawler]

Think of it this way...

This?

The Wizards affects of magic aren't overridden by the Chaos Warlock who is obviously an inferior magic wielder. The Wizard's spell is still valid.

Or this?
If it's the second, this is pure conjecture and doesn't apply to the argument as it has nothing to do with anything debated here.
If it's your way of interpreting this stuff, go ahead, but it's bending and breaking existing rules.

The most important part of the quote is
"...reducing to 1. Now total of 3."
See, this is outright funny and a little crazy. Which is it now, 1 or 3?

[j_dean80]

Think of it this way...

This?

The Wizards affects of magic aren't overridden by the Chaos Warlock who is obviously an inferior magic wielder. The Wizard's spell is still valid.

Or this?
If it's the second, this is pure conjecture and doesn't apply to the argument as it has nothing to do with anything debated here.
If it's your way of interpreting this stuff, go ahead, but it's bending and breaking existing rules.

The most important part of the quote is
"...reducing to 1. Now total of 3."
See, this is outright funny and a little crazy. Which is it now, 1 or 3?

The Wizard's spell would still be in effect as it said "2 extra" not adding 2. Again the wording as you mis-mentioned.

[knightkrawler]

Once again, Fear reduces to "1".
It, unfortunately or not, does negate Courage through its wording, if you want it to or not.
Otherwise, Fear wouldn't have an effect at all, because its effect as worded would contradict itself, so...

The misreading is on a very basic linguistic level, so I don't know how to keep this up...

[The Admiral]

I see Fear as reducing the base attack value to 1. Courage then adds to that. So in my opinion a basic Barbarian with Fear and Courage is attack 3.

[j_dean80]

Once again, Fear reduces to "1".
It, unfortunately or not, does negate Courage through its wording, if you want it to or not.

By your definition Fear overrides Courage no matter the order because it states a solid 1.

[Gold Bearer]

OK. Apples, then.
(...Oh, I'm well aware I'll probably get a lot of flak for the style of this post, and worse, people will counter-argue my argument out of spite because I'll be sounding condescending now...)

You have three apples. These are "your" apples.
First, you're told to take another two apples from the basket. Now you have five apples.
Then, you're told to put away all but one apple.
You are left with one apple.

You have three apples. These are "your" apples.
First, you're told to put all but one of your apples back into the basket. This leaves you with one apple.
Then, you may take two apples from the basket.
You have three apples.

Two one-off effects applied in different orders.
___________________________________________________________

The equipment/artefact card analogy:

You have two apples.
Daddy tells you you may replace those two by four different apples. Now you have four apples.
At the same time, Mommy tells you you may take another two apples from the basket at the same time.
You have six apples because daddy's and mommy's instructions apply.

Two or more permanent effects that at any given time stack onto each other, as per the wordings and grammar in the card texts - NOT because I say so.

This isn't out of any kind of spite and if we could keep it cordial (I know posh words) that would be nice.

You're two analogies are fine. My problem with your argument is why would you use one for equipment and the other for spells? With equipment it's obvious that your second analogy applies. To me that settles the matter, there's no reason why it should work any differently just because the cards have a different picture on their back, or because of duration of the effect.

Once again, Fear reduces to "1".
It, unfortunately or not, does negate Courage through its wording, if you want it to or not.

Then armour DOES negate shields and helmets, that's obviously not how it works though.

Edit:

Users browsing this forum: clmckay, Gold Bearer, j_dean80, knightkrawler, The Admiral

Let's have a party, anyone got any drugs?

[j_dean80]

I see Fear as reducing the base attack value to 1. Courage then adds to that. So in my opinion a basic Barbarian with Fear and Courage is attack 3.

Agree

[Gold Bearer]

Actually I'm changing my position, sort of.

I'm mixing the original rules with the US rules. I use the original rules with the US spells and doing that it's definitely three attack dice with courage + fear because of the president of the armour changing the base defence dice that are then modified by other stuff. In the US version all armour gives +1/2 dice and without that president knightkrawler is right, it gives one attack dice regardless of courage.

This is the problem with a dodgy inferior counterfeit version (the US in general ), it creates confusion.

[clmckay]

Users browsing this forum: clmckay, Gold Bearer, j_dean80, knightkrawler, The Admiral

Let's have a party, anyone got any drugs?[/quote]


It seems like there may already be some in use.

I don't even begin to understand why this needs the debate that's going on here.