France or Γαλλία

[Patroclus]

This has nothing to do with HQ, but I think a talk about history is always interesting in a forum about the “old world”.

Here in Greece, the name we use today for France is “Γαλλία” (Gallia) and for French is “Γάλλοι” (Galli) and the language “Γαλλικά” (Gallika). And this, because in this area live Galatians (Celts). Then comes the Roman Empire and the Galatians became a part of Roman Empire as almost the whole Europe, but after that came the Franks (German tribes) and conquer the area and call it France. But I believe the Galatians who became Roman, and after that, Franks, are still the native owners of that land. The language also, does not sound like German. So, I am wondering if the French today feel more like Franks or the way we called you are more accurate. Of course, there were so many tribes in Europe that it’s hard to say, but as we talk about history it’s nice to hear your opinion.

[Anderas]

Karl der Große, Charlemagne, i think more or less 800 after christ, was uniting big parts of what is today Germany, France, Belgium and then some. When he died, under his weak son, the western part declared themselves independent - most of it is the today's france.
Ok it is not really comparable to today; because at that times land & people was private ownership. So it was possible that you had a dot here and a speckle there and it was all yours, with huge gaps in between. The Northern part of Bavaria for example is called "Franken".

The other way round, i heard from a Greek that greek don't like to be called "greek" but instead prefer something like "Hellas"; and "hellas people"?

[Patroclus]

Galatians live in the whole area, they invaded in Greece too and even further to the Asia Minor (about 200 before Christ). But it’s impossible to get vanished, even in ancient Rome they have Galatian mercenaries, I’ve never heard for a genocide or migration to other places, so I guess they are your ancestors.

About the name “Greece”, it’s true that some don’t like it because we use for ourselves the “Ελλάδα” (Hellada) or “Ελλάς” (Hellas) but there is no difference. The Greek was the name before the great cataclysm of Deucalion (mythology 1265BC) [he was the son of Prometheus]. It is exactly like the story of Noah's Ark from the bible. Zeus brings a flood and only Deucalion and his woman are saved with the ark, then they ask from the oracle at Delphi how to repopulate the world, they solve the riddle (to close their eyes with a cloth and throw the bones of their mother) and finally they do it by throwing rocks(!). The first rock was the “Έλληνας” who became the king, and all the others take his name. All this are saved from Apollodoros about 100BC. But also in Paros Island there is a writing (264BC) that says “before Hellenes there were Greeks”.

[Big Bene]

Charlemagne / Karl der Große was king of the Franks (or rather "Franconians" would be the correct English term), the second of his family. The predecessors of this dynasty were the Merowingers (also Franconians). Their ancestors were Germanic, but their kingdom included the area of modern France and some of the westernmost part of Germany.
The French consider themselfes as heirs of the merowinger and franconian kingdoms / empires. At least, in french history classes, children learn these dynasties in line with the french kings - from Merowech, the mythical ancestor of the Merowingers, to Louis XVI who died on the guillotine 1793.

[Patroclus]

Thanks for the info Big Bene. They do know better who they are and it makes sense. The Franks was a huge nation, they also conquer Greece for almost 400 years (1204-1566) with the crusades. But they only rule the area. It’s nonsense to slay everyone because then you only leave ruins, and no one conquers a land just to leave ruins. You need the people to produce and bring wealth.

This could be a reason why we still call them Galatians, because maybe they have never slain them all(?). But I guess it’s only a theory, we may keep calling them like this just because we used to call the area Galatia. I don’t know and I can’t find the true reason. But I will continue the search just for curiosity.

[Patroclus]

I’ve found something interesting in Diodorus Siculus (80BC), he said above Celts (the Galatians) there where a fertile island bigger than Sicily (Great Britain?) with the Hyperboreans (Υπερβόρειοι) (Υπερ=Hyper=Super, Βορράς=North). He said, that there was born Leto (daughter of titans and mother of Apollo and Artemis). The people there worship Apollo and they have a great temple decorated with lots of offerings. The temple was in a circle shape (Stonehenge?).

It is known that Apollo, in the winter does not make prophecies, leaves Delphi to Dionysus and goes to Hyperborea. So, he may visit Stonehenge?

ps: you can find it in English: Diodorus Siculus book 2, 47. http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Diodorus_Siculus/2B*.html

[Anderas]

That's cool that fits so well! And the wording could be directly from Conan. I love it.